Identifying Sales Talent the right way. By Lucas Price

1
00:00:05,200 --> 00:00:07,800
They're releasing to fundraising
video a podcast about

2
00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:10,100
fundraising for early-stage
startups.

3
00:00:10,500 --> 00:00:13,600
The major rules that we follow
here is no bullshit on this

4
00:00:13,600 --> 00:00:16,100
podcast.
No music to relax, you know,

5
00:00:16,100 --> 00:00:19,100
advertisements of our sponsors.
And in this new season of

6
00:00:19,100 --> 00:00:22,800
fundraising radio, we are
changing things up and talking

7
00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:26,100
about sales, for early-stage
startups, instead of just the

8
00:00:26,100 --> 00:00:29,600
fundraising portion of it.
And today's guest, speaker will

9
00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:33,600
have Lucas price, founder and
CEO at yardstick yardstick

10
00:00:33,600 --> 00:00:37,000
optimizes your sales hiring by
using the best entry questions,

11
00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:40,700
structured, interviews and
scorecards to identify sales

12
00:00:40,700 --> 00:00:42,800
towns.
And this is exactly what we're

13
00:00:42,800 --> 00:00:44,000
going to cover in this
interview.

14
00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:46,800
We're going to cover how you
Founders can figure out.

15
00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:49,600
What kind of questions to ask,
how to work westerns such as

16
00:00:49,800 --> 00:00:53,200
what is your greatest weakness
and things of such.

17
00:00:53,200 --> 00:00:56,700
And also we're going to cover of
course what are scorecards and

18
00:00:56,700 --> 00:00:59,500
how they are used in.
And Lucas is hiring process.

19
00:00:59,800 --> 00:01:02,400
So with that in mind, Lucas
let's kick it off with your

20
00:01:02,400 --> 00:01:07,200
short backgrounds and just a few
words about your stick from

21
00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:09,700
yourself.
Yeah, Constantine.

22
00:01:09,700 --> 00:01:13,700
Thanks for having me.
I before starting yardstick, I

23
00:01:13,708 --> 00:01:18,800
was the VP of sales, the head of
sales at zip whip, which was a

24
00:01:18,808 --> 00:01:24,000
text messaging software company,
we took business phone numbers

25
00:01:24,100 --> 00:01:26,400
and turned to bond to the text
messaging system and then gave

26
00:01:26,400 --> 00:01:29,000
them software to manage their
customer conversation.

27
00:01:29,500 --> 00:01:35,800
I grew the was part of growing
the company from 250,000 dollars

28
00:01:35,800 --> 00:01:40,000
in mrr built the team.
The sales team that took it to

29
00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:43,900
over 100 million dollars in.
And in ARR, I'm sorry, I said

30
00:01:43,900 --> 00:01:48,900
I'm ar-ar-ar-ar on both of these
two hundred fifty to a hundred

31
00:01:48,900 --> 00:01:52,300
million and they are before it
sold the Tulio almost two years

32
00:01:52,300 --> 00:01:56,200
ago for 850 million and after
some time off and kind of

33
00:01:56,200 --> 00:01:58,800
thinking about some of the
problems that I faced it zip

34
00:01:58,800 --> 00:02:01,200
Whip and how there could be a
software solution to them,

35
00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:03,200
that's when I decided to start
yardstick.

36
00:02:03,900 --> 00:02:06,900
That is a cool background story
and thanks for sharing that one.

37
00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:08,699
So it will start.
Zip whip.

38
00:02:08,699 --> 00:02:12,800
Just a few more words since you
did reach quite a bit of success

39
00:02:12,800 --> 00:02:14,900
there.
Let's talk a little bit.

40
00:02:14,900 --> 00:02:17,100
How you started that back to the
success.

41
00:02:17,100 --> 00:02:20,700
So when you joint was like what
you worked there for about

42
00:02:20,700 --> 00:02:23,000
almost six years and you started
in 2014.

43
00:02:23,000 --> 00:02:26,600
So when you just joined zip
whip, what were the first steps

44
00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:30,400
that you just took to get the
company on the right path to get

45
00:02:30,400 --> 00:02:32,700
to that 100 million dollars in
ARR?

46
00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:37,600
Yeah, there were a couple
sellers that were that were

47
00:02:39,600 --> 00:02:43,300
Somewhat productive when I
joined but they were there was

48
00:02:43,300 --> 00:02:45,300
not a lot of visibility into
what they were doing.

49
00:02:45,300 --> 00:02:48,600
There was no CRM, everything was
just in emails, the emails

50
00:02:48,600 --> 00:02:50,800
weren't being compiled into
spreadsheets and stuff like

51
00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:53,100
that.
And so the first thing I did was

52
00:02:53,100 --> 00:02:56,100
try to figure out the truth of
what was really happening where

53
00:02:56,100 --> 00:02:59,100
our customers were coming from.
Why the customers were buying

54
00:02:59,100 --> 00:03:03,200
the product, how productive the
sellers were, what type of

55
00:03:03,200 --> 00:03:05,900
inbound that we were getting.
And so, you know, the very first

56
00:03:05,900 --> 00:03:08,000
thing was was like find out the
truth.

57
00:03:08,100 --> 00:03:10,000
Ruth.
And the way I did that at the

58
00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:15,100
time was through Salesforce, you
know, HubSpot stools were not as

59
00:03:15,100 --> 00:03:18,300
good on the CRM side then as
they are now and so Salesforce

60
00:03:18,300 --> 00:03:21,200
was really the go-to for
everyone we set up Salesforce

61
00:03:21,200 --> 00:03:23,600
and started getting a lot of our
data flowing into their really

62
00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:25,800
quickly so that we can kind of
see the truth of what happened

63
00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:30,100
and make decisions from there.
Yep, starts with around.

64
00:03:30,100 --> 00:03:33,700
That's most of it does.
That is great.

65
00:03:34,100 --> 00:03:37,100
On this note, quick question, on
the management side of things.

66
00:03:37,100 --> 00:03:39,900
So you did say that, you know,
it was unclear what the sales

67
00:03:39,900 --> 00:03:42,400
people are doing, you know,
there is not much transparency.

68
00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:45,000
And yet, here I am definitely
fixes a lot of those questions.

69
00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:48,700
But what I've seen some Founders
do is be extraordinarily

70
00:03:48,700 --> 00:03:52,300
overbearing over sales people,
so not just the CRM but also

71
00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:56,100
pretty much updates on every
other deal that they're working

72
00:03:56,100 --> 00:03:57,100
on.
Like, what's going on?

73
00:03:57,100 --> 00:03:59,300
What kind of help?
They need and just gets under

74
00:03:59,300 --> 00:04:02,200
people's skin seen in far too
many times.

75
00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:07,000
Where do you think is this limit
between being overbearing / or

76
00:04:08,300 --> 00:04:12,400
being actually supportive?
Yeah, you know, that's a good

77
00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:16,399
question and it's hard to answer
in the in the abstract.

78
00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:20,100
You know.
The, I think the reality is is

79
00:04:20,100 --> 00:04:25,200
that when you have a salesperson
show up on day, one, that you're

80
00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:29,100
going, even if it's only for the
first few days, you need to be a

81
00:04:29,100 --> 00:04:36,400
little bit of I guess what
micromanager, you know, while

82
00:04:36,400 --> 00:04:39,300
you're gaining trust with them.
And and that might just, that

83
00:04:39,300 --> 00:04:41,700
might only last a few days.
But they need to learn the

84
00:04:41,700 --> 00:04:45,200
things in the first few days.
And so it might feel if you had

85
00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:48,800
that level of Engagement forever
then it might feel

86
00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:52,200
micromanaging.
And so there is a so hopefully

87
00:04:52,500 --> 00:04:57,400
the salesperson is really taking
hold of their ownership over

88
00:04:57,400 --> 00:05:00,300
their own results and stuff like
that early on and you build

89
00:05:00,300 --> 00:05:02,400
trust and you don't have to
micromanage.

90
00:05:02,700 --> 00:05:08,300
And, and that's, you know, part
of on the other hand, If you

91
00:05:08,300 --> 00:05:10,500
hired the wrong salesperson,
you're going to continually You

92
00:05:10,500 --> 00:05:12,100
feel like you need to
micromanage.

93
00:05:12,100 --> 00:05:14,100
And then as a manager you need
to be able to tell the

94
00:05:14,100 --> 00:05:16,000
difference between the two.
You need to tell the difference

95
00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:20,300
between like okay, I hired
someone who is taking ownership,

96
00:05:20,300 --> 00:05:23,200
who is doing the right steps and
so I need to give them the right

97
00:05:23,200 --> 00:05:27,900
support, but not be overbearing.
It's hard to kind of say

98
00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:30,300
specifically what that means
without looking at the

99
00:05:30,300 --> 00:05:32,600
individual situation.
But there definitely is a

100
00:05:32,608 --> 00:05:37,400
balance there 100%.
Lets you know, this podcast was

101
00:05:37,400 --> 00:05:40,600
built upon the Moto of no
bullshit, which means that We're

102
00:05:40,600 --> 00:05:42,000
trying to give some actionable
advice.

103
00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:45,400
So let's try to plug in some
actionable advice here and give

104
00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:47,400
some specifics on.
Let's see number of meeting.

105
00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:50,500
So, let's say you have a team of
10 people through them.

106
00:05:50,500 --> 00:05:53,700
Our sales people want as a CEO
who's kind of head of sales just

107
00:05:53,700 --> 00:05:56,600
because you don't currently have
a head of sales with that in

108
00:05:56,600 --> 00:05:59,800
mind how many team meetings and
how many individual meetings

109
00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:05,800
should there be Yeah, I will.
So you know again this is I

110
00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:07,500
think there's different answers
to this.

111
00:06:07,700 --> 00:06:10,900
Yeah.
Certainly when, when I, by the

112
00:06:10,900 --> 00:06:14,800
time, I got a big sales
organization up and running at

113
00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:18,500
zip whip, like, I was really
into the rituals, I believe that

114
00:06:18,500 --> 00:06:19,800
the rituals are really
important.

115
00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:22,800
And so every team, every manager
I wanted them to have a team

116
00:06:22,800 --> 00:06:25,300
meeting every single week and
then I wanted to have a

117
00:06:25,308 --> 00:06:29,000
one-on-one every week and those
are just kind of the basics of

118
00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:33,400
like, of And then we would have
our at all sales organization

119
00:06:33,400 --> 00:06:35,400
meeting every week, and then
we'd have all companies that

120
00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:38,400
recorder and stuff like that.
And so, I think, when you get,

121
00:06:38,400 --> 00:06:41,400
when the company gets to a
certain size, like having those

122
00:06:41,400 --> 00:06:44,700
rituals is really, really
important that a smaller size.

123
00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:47,400
I still think that, you know,
having a one-on-one with each

124
00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:51,500
employee every week.
In addition, to providing them

125
00:06:51,500 --> 00:06:53,100
the support that they need
through.

126
00:06:53,100 --> 00:06:57,600
The day-to-day is part of
enablement, you know, part of

127
00:06:57,600 --> 00:07:00,700
allowing them to be successful.
I think that like button.

128
00:07:00,900 --> 00:07:03,200
That one-on-one meeting is not
necessarily.

129
00:07:03,500 --> 00:07:06,300
Tell me every detail about
everything that's happening

130
00:07:06,300 --> 00:07:08,400
every week.
You know, a lot of it is like

131
00:07:08,700 --> 00:07:13,100
what what is the most important
information or help that I can

132
00:07:13,100 --> 00:07:14,800
provide you to move your deals
along.

133
00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:18,000
And so you're really looking for
sales people who will take

134
00:07:18,000 --> 00:07:22,600
ownership of that meeting and
will it will direct you instead

135
00:07:22,600 --> 00:07:24,900
of you having to micromanage and
direct them?

136
00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:28,800
100%.
So, let's just continue grilling

137
00:07:28,800 --> 00:07:32,100
on the CEOs who don't have too
much of experience in the sales

138
00:07:32,100 --> 00:07:34,600
part.
So we did on our pre-interview

139
00:07:34,600 --> 00:07:37,500
call, talk about something
called over demoing or basically

140
00:07:37,500 --> 00:07:41,100
overselling.
Can you describe that process?

141
00:07:41,100 --> 00:07:43,900
And then we're going to go into
the full of questions on how to

142
00:07:43,900 --> 00:07:46,800
avoided.
Yeah, I think every mistake that

143
00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:49,600
almost every CEO will make at
the very beginning when they

144
00:07:49,600 --> 00:07:52,900
first have their product in
market and they identified a

145
00:07:52,907 --> 00:07:55,400
customer who's interested in
looking at it.

146
00:07:55,700 --> 00:07:57,900
Is that they'll want to, you
know?

147
00:07:57,900 --> 00:08:03,100
They you've spent so much time
building this piece of software

148
00:08:03,100 --> 00:08:06,300
that has all these details and
you'll want to show every detail

149
00:08:06,300 --> 00:08:08,800
and you'll think that every
detail is important.

150
00:08:09,100 --> 00:08:13,100
And so over demoing, you know,
I've done this and I've talked

151
00:08:13,100 --> 00:08:15,000
to lots of other Founders.
We've done this where you're

152
00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:19,700
like, okay I spent 45 minutes
showing someone every little

153
00:08:19,700 --> 00:08:22,800
piece of the software and at the
end I could tell that they were

154
00:08:22,800 --> 00:08:24,800
really bored and they couldn't
get off.

155
00:08:24,800 --> 00:08:27,000
Get wait.
Get off the call, not because

156
00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:29,300
they're not interested in what
we're doing but because I just

157
00:08:29,300 --> 00:08:34,200
showed them too much and so what
you want to do as a CEO seller

158
00:08:34,500 --> 00:08:36,900
and the sellers that you hire if
they're good, they'll know this.

159
00:08:36,900 --> 00:08:40,900
But what you want to do is you
want to think about like what is

160
00:08:41,100 --> 00:08:45,200
really important for to the to
this Persona, like how can I get

161
00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:48,000
them to the business results
that it's going to create for

162
00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:50,900
them by showing them the least
product possible?

163
00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:54,200
And, you know, and there's a
process early on as well, you

164
00:08:54,200 --> 00:08:59,900
know, in sales we call Discovery
where you ask questions for you

165
00:08:59,900 --> 00:09:03,300
demo to find out what are the
business results that your

166
00:09:03,300 --> 00:09:06,800
software can produce or your
product can produce that they

167
00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:09,900
really care about.
And so now you're not showing

168
00:09:09,900 --> 00:09:13,000
them every detail of the
software anymore, that's the

169
00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:16,500
over demoing, what you're trying
to show them is just the pieces

170
00:09:16,500 --> 00:09:19,100
that tied to the business
results that are really, really

171
00:09:19,100 --> 00:09:20,900
important to them.
Yep.

172
00:09:21,100 --> 00:09:23,800
Hundred percent.
If you're jumping on a demo

173
00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:28,100
without a discovery cold prior
May your jump to failed personal

174
00:09:28,100 --> 00:09:30,200
advice.
I think for me, what work best

175
00:09:30,400 --> 00:09:33,200
to avoid over demo and is
preparing a small pitch deck.

176
00:09:33,600 --> 00:09:38,100
And I having a structure of all
the features that are on in your

177
00:09:38,100 --> 00:09:41,800
product.
And then after the discovery

178
00:09:41,800 --> 00:09:45,200
call, you just select where,
like, Mark in Reds, the ones

179
00:09:45,200 --> 00:09:49,100
that you're prepping to actually
demo and then before the demo

180
00:09:49,100 --> 00:09:51,000
starts, you say, hey, here are
the things that we're going to

181
00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:52,600
go over.
Does that sound good?

182
00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:54,800
Or do you want to do?
See anything else on this chart

183
00:09:54,800 --> 00:09:57,000
that you want to?
See or take like a closer look

184
00:09:57,000 --> 00:10:01,000
at highly recommend works
perfectly engages the clients or

185
00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:04,100
potential clients this case and
also keeps you organized and

186
00:10:04,100 --> 00:10:06,600
have to make sure you do it
beforehand.

187
00:10:07,100 --> 00:10:10,000
So that is a strategy that
worked for me in the past.

188
00:10:11,100 --> 00:10:13,900
So we covered some sales ports
here.

189
00:10:14,100 --> 00:10:16,600
Now, let's go into the main
subject of today's episode,

190
00:10:16,600 --> 00:10:19,200
which is the process of hiring.
It's a pain, the ass, especially

191
00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:22,400
if you don't have any chars
person who has experience in

192
00:10:22,400 --> 00:10:26,600
that and especially in sales
because again, On the job of a

193
00:10:26,608 --> 00:10:30,000
salesperson is to sell and when
you're hiring someone, they're

194
00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:33,200
selling themselves so they have
a competitive Advantage there.

195
00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:37,200
So with that in mind, Lucas,
what is your advice on making

196
00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:40,500
the first sales hire, who should
Founders look for ends?

197
00:10:40,500 --> 00:10:45,200
Where most importantly Yeah, I
think I'm a very common mistake

198
00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:48,900
with the first sales.
Hire is hiring someone who has a

199
00:10:48,900 --> 00:10:54,100
track record of doing of
executing a sales Playbook at a

200
00:10:54,100 --> 00:10:57,000
high level.
And so, you know, maybe they

201
00:10:57,000 --> 00:10:59,900
come from a company, maybe the
company has a good brand, maybe

202
00:10:59,900 --> 00:11:02,600
it doesn't, but it definitely
was, you know, the product was

203
00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:06,200
in Market when they were there
and, you know, maybe they were

204
00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:08,200
one of the top performers and
you think, oh, I'm going to

205
00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:10,300
bring all that performance to my
company.

206
00:11:10,700 --> 00:11:13,600
But, you know, When you're
making your first hire your

207
00:11:13,600 --> 00:11:16,000
company doesn't have the same
traction doesn't have the same

208
00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:18,800
playbook in the Playbook that
they ran at their previous

209
00:11:18,800 --> 00:11:20,500
companies.
There's a good chance that it

210
00:11:20,500 --> 00:11:23,900
won't work at your company.
And so what you're looking for

211
00:11:23,900 --> 00:11:29,500
is people who have experience
and really enjoy kind of being

212
00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:33,400
the first seller or one of the
first sellers at a company

213
00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:36,200
that's building its traction.
They have to be incredibly

214
00:11:36,200 --> 00:11:40,100
resourceful have to be able to
take ownership, FB good kind of

215
00:11:40,100 --> 00:11:42,900
experimenting with messaging.
And seeing what type of

216
00:11:42,900 --> 00:11:45,400
messaging really lands with the
customers.

217
00:11:45,400 --> 00:11:49,600
And so when you're when you're
the fifth higher somewhere, you

218
00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:53,500
don't do much experimenting with
messaging, you know, you kind of

219
00:11:53,500 --> 00:11:55,700
take the messaging that's been
working from all the other

220
00:11:55,700 --> 00:11:59,100
Sellers and from the marketing
and you use that, those are the

221
00:11:59,100 --> 00:12:00,600
things that you say to your
customer.

222
00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:03,600
But when you're the first
seller, you have to be like

223
00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:07,400
really kind of dynamic and and
you know, be able to be able to

224
00:12:07,400 --> 00:12:10,900
create something out of nothing.
And so it really is a different

225
00:12:10,900 --> 00:12:13,600
job and you have I think about
it very differently in terms of

226
00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:18,400
the profile 100% no on to the
second question of that first

227
00:12:18,400 --> 00:12:20,900
question, which is where to look
for them.

228
00:12:20,900 --> 00:12:23,000
So shoulds, Founders just post
on LinkedIn.

229
00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:25,900
Should they go straight to job
boards?

230
00:12:25,900 --> 00:12:30,000
Like indeed, glass door and all
those other job boards where

231
00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:33,600
masses are looking for positions
or should they focus on more

232
00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:37,000
Niche Fields like Angeles, worst
just exclusively, starves.

233
00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:42,100
Yeah, I always think that the
answer is all of the above,

234
00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:47,700
when, when you're trying to
build a pipeline of talent, the

235
00:12:47,700 --> 00:12:49,400
you never know where they're
going to come from.

236
00:12:49,400 --> 00:12:52,400
I mean, in addition to that, I'd
work your personal networks

237
00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:54,200
hard.
Like if, you know, someone who

238
00:12:54,200 --> 00:12:57,800
you think would be good at the
job, I'd ask them if they know

239
00:12:58,100 --> 00:13:03,100
anyone who, who like similar to
them, who had similar experience

240
00:13:03,100 --> 00:13:09,300
to them, who might be looking,
if you're in a incubator or An

241
00:13:09,300 --> 00:13:13,800
accelerator, you know, I would
ask the mentors there, how to

242
00:13:13,800 --> 00:13:16,300
find them, where to find them
and say, no.

243
00:13:16,300 --> 00:13:21,700
So that I think the answer is,
you know, within the time limits

244
00:13:21,700 --> 00:13:24,900
and constraints that you have
look at every channel possible.

245
00:13:24,900 --> 00:13:29,000
Yep, to find Talent 100%.
Now let's go over to the

246
00:13:29,000 --> 00:13:30,900
questions.
That's a big part of the

247
00:13:30,900 --> 00:13:33,700
interview.
A lot of people get it wrong.

248
00:13:33,700 --> 00:13:36,300
Myself included, by the way, I
did make a lot of bad hires in

249
00:13:36,300 --> 00:13:38,700
the past, so Learned the hard
way.

250
00:13:38,700 --> 00:13:41,200
But for you personally, what
have you seen to be the best

251
00:13:41,200 --> 00:13:43,000
practices?
And again, yardstick that's kind

252
00:13:43,000 --> 00:13:45,700
of their your focus.
So, tell us a little bit more

253
00:13:45,700 --> 00:13:47,300
about that strategy.
How do you prepare those

254
00:13:47,300 --> 00:13:49,300
questions?
Are there any questions that you

255
00:13:49,308 --> 00:13:53,200
have to ask on every single
sales interview or is there not

256
00:13:53,200 --> 00:13:56,800
a single Silver Bullet?
Yeah, so I think the important

257
00:13:56,800 --> 00:14:00,000
part is is some of the things
we've been talking about already

258
00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:04,500
is like making sure you get the
profile nailed first.

259
00:14:04,500 --> 00:14:07,600
Like if you start with the
questions instead of starting

260
00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:09,400
like this, This is what they
really need to do.

261
00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:11,300
And this is what they really
need to accomplish.

262
00:14:11,400 --> 00:14:13,100
You're going to end up with the
wrong questions.

263
00:14:13,100 --> 00:14:17,000
And so you get the, you get the
ideal candidate profile.

264
00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:19,600
Really nailed the first, and
part of that is, like, what are

265
00:14:19,600 --> 00:14:22,300
the goals that this person needs
to accomplish and really

266
00:14:22,300 --> 00:14:25,500
thinking about if they've been
successful?

267
00:14:25,700 --> 00:14:27,700
But you're from now what if
they've done?

268
00:14:27,700 --> 00:14:30,400
Or if they have not been
successful, what have they not

269
00:14:30,400 --> 00:14:32,900
done?
Like getting that down on paper,

270
00:14:33,500 --> 00:14:36,400
you know what are what behaviors
and competencies.

271
00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:37,900
Are they going to need to
accomplish?

272
00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:41,000
Push those goals and then that
kind of leads you into the

273
00:14:41,000 --> 00:14:45,000
questions.
And so the the questions

274
00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:50,500
themselves are in a way are like
a lot of people want to start

275
00:14:50,500 --> 00:14:54,200
their but if you just have some
need interview questions that

276
00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:56,600
won't lead to success.
It's really like, really having

277
00:14:56,600 --> 00:14:59,400
thought about the whole process
is, hey, I'm going to put

278
00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:02,000
everyone through the same
process because I've built the

279
00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:04,300
process ahead of time.
And so, you know, you might

280
00:15:04,300 --> 00:15:07,400
think about, alright, in a very
small company, it's going to be

281
00:15:07,400 --> 00:15:09,200
three in Views.
It's going to be me my

282
00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:13,100
co-founder and, you know,
whoever the head of product or

283
00:15:13,100 --> 00:15:17,200
whatever or maybe and and so
what are each of us willing to

284
00:15:17,200 --> 00:15:20,000
cover, like we've established,
what the important goals are,

285
00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:22,000
what the important
characteristics are.

286
00:15:22,500 --> 00:15:27,400
And now you'll get.
If you ask every candidate, the

287
00:15:27,400 --> 00:15:30,600
same small set of questions
where each question is really

288
00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:34,100
like a conversation in each
interview, you'll start to get

289
00:15:34,100 --> 00:15:38,500
differentiated answers between
the candidates that Lead you to

290
00:15:38,500 --> 00:15:41,000
the right path.
If you don't have a plan and you

291
00:15:41,000 --> 00:15:43,700
just show up and you have a
couple questions and you just

292
00:15:43,700 --> 00:15:47,000
kind of chitchat and then figure
out questions.

293
00:15:47,300 --> 00:15:50,400
Then you're not actually going
to end up with differentiated

294
00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:55,000
answers and you're going to end
up making a guess about who to

295
00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:58,100
hire and who not to hire.
So there's a lot of interview

296
00:15:58,100 --> 00:16:00,500
questions that I love but I
think the important part is

297
00:16:00,500 --> 00:16:04,200
getting is like if you do the
planning, if you do a couple

298
00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:07,900
hours of planning ahead of time,
it's going to save you.

299
00:16:07,900 --> 00:16:10,200
You're thousands of hours of
pain down the road.

300
00:16:10,200 --> 00:16:12,700
And so before you get to the
question, get those other pieces

301
00:16:12,700 --> 00:16:17,200
in place, it, you know, is what
I always tell people.

302
00:16:17,200 --> 00:16:19,700
And that's a big part of what
yardstick makes it easy to do

303
00:16:19,700 --> 00:16:23,500
is, is, you know, not to turn
this into an advertisement.

304
00:16:23,500 --> 00:16:26,100
But but someone who doesn't know
how to do that.

305
00:16:26,100 --> 00:16:28,600
We could, you know, the software
kind of hold your hold your hand

306
00:16:28,600 --> 00:16:32,100
and walk walks, you through
that, to create a consistent and

307
00:16:32,100 --> 00:16:34,500
rigorous process.
Oh, yeah, no, that's perfect.

308
00:16:34,500 --> 00:16:37,800
Let's actually again,
fundraising radio is enough.

309
00:16:37,900 --> 00:16:40,600
Nonprofit the podcast part of
its, the probably has branches a

310
00:16:40,608 --> 00:16:42,500
complete non profit.
We're not getting anything out

311
00:16:42,500 --> 00:16:44,400
of this.
This is not advertisement but

312
00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:47,700
there's one of the reasons why I
brought Lucas which is they have

313
00:16:47,700 --> 00:16:50,500
a very structured approach to
the specific process, which I

314
00:16:50,508 --> 00:16:53,500
don't see that often.
I myself have not done in the

315
00:16:53,500 --> 00:16:54,900
past.
I've done exactly what Lucas

316
00:16:54,900 --> 00:16:56,300
said.
I have like a few questions

317
00:16:56,300 --> 00:16:58,500
prepared and then the rest of
it, I just come up on the Fly

318
00:16:58,500 --> 00:17:01,500
because, you know, I'm a host of
a podcast, like I'm gonna come

319
00:17:01,500 --> 00:17:02,900
up with questions on the fly,
right?

320
00:17:02,900 --> 00:17:05,800
No, I failed miserably.
So let's talk a little bit more

321
00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:08,599
about that structure process.
Let's see.

322
00:17:08,599 --> 00:17:12,099
Founders don't want to use
yardstick where to begin.

323
00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:15,700
You said begin with basically
creating the ICP for

324
00:17:15,700 --> 00:17:18,700
salesperson, right?
And then can you come up or it

325
00:17:18,700 --> 00:17:22,300
can you can you give us like a
few examples of good versus bad

326
00:17:22,300 --> 00:17:24,300
questions for the interview just
like one or two.

327
00:17:24,300 --> 00:17:27,500
Just so that we have all point
of reference or at least some

328
00:17:27,500 --> 00:17:29,700
kind of idea of what, what those
look like.

329
00:17:30,100 --> 00:17:32,400
Yeah.
So, you know, one thing that I

330
00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:35,200
like to ask in the screening
call again.

331
00:17:35,200 --> 00:17:37,200
So this is some this screening
call.

332
00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:40,900
The US is I'm having one
conversation to decide whether I

333
00:17:40,900 --> 00:17:44,200
want to put them through a more
rigorous interview process.

334
00:17:44,600 --> 00:17:47,400
So, on the screening call, I'll
ask a question.

335
00:17:47,400 --> 00:17:51,500
Like, can you tell me about
something complex that you

336
00:17:51,500 --> 00:17:53,600
understand?
Well, that you can explain to me

337
00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:57,000
in 30 seconds.
And so from that, just trying to

338
00:17:57,008 --> 00:18:02,700
get an idea of their ability to
articulate complex ideas and

339
00:18:02,700 --> 00:18:04,500
make them simple and make them
digestible.

340
00:18:05,400 --> 00:18:09,500
That is a good question.
Hard to come up with an answer

341
00:18:09,500 --> 00:18:11,300
of, why do I feel like I'm
struggling.

342
00:18:11,300 --> 00:18:13,800
I'm trying to go up on the Fly.
I'm struggling here.

343
00:18:14,300 --> 00:18:16,700
Yeah, one of the things I like
to tell people before, the

344
00:18:16,700 --> 00:18:18,700
interviews is what, you know,
some of these questions are

345
00:18:18,700 --> 00:18:21,300
going to take a minute for you
to think of a good example and I

346
00:18:21,308 --> 00:18:25,400
find it take time, it's fine for
us to you know I know after 4

347
00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:27,900
seconds of Silence people start
to become uncomfortable.

348
00:18:27,900 --> 00:18:31,100
Let's just go back with.
It's okay to just tell me you

349
00:18:31,100 --> 00:18:34,500
need to hold on for a minute.
You know yourself, a few notes

350
00:18:34,500 --> 00:18:37,600
before you answer.
That's okay with the types of

351
00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:39,600
Questions that I ask because
some of them are going to be a

352
00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:42,600
little bit challenging.
Hmm, does sound like that?

353
00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:45,300
And one example of a bad
question just so that everyone

354
00:18:45,300 --> 00:18:48,000
can steer clear of those types
of questions.

355
00:18:49,000 --> 00:18:54,900
Tell me the pen.
All right, why is it such a big

356
00:18:54,900 --> 00:19:02,600
question?
it's, it's You know what, we're

357
00:19:02,600 --> 00:19:04,600
not looking.
We are looking for a certain

358
00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:07,200
communication, ability by a
sales person, which, you know, I

359
00:19:07,200 --> 00:19:10,100
think that that other question
gets you, but we're not looking

360
00:19:10,100 --> 00:19:15,200
for is people who can just go
and Pitch anything without any

361
00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:17,500
contacts.
Like, you know, we're looking

362
00:19:17,500 --> 00:19:19,800
for Sellers, as you said, we're
looking for people who can do

363
00:19:19,800 --> 00:19:23,500
good Discovery, who are good
listeners and not people who can

364
00:19:23,500 --> 00:19:28,100
just you know it's not
necessarily selling.

365
00:19:28,100 --> 00:19:32,800
It's not necessarily about just
about being Fast on your feet.

366
00:19:32,800 --> 00:19:35,000
Which, you know, I think sell me
this pen gets to.

367
00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:38,900
It's also about like building a
plan and having a plan and being

368
00:19:38,900 --> 00:19:42,300
able to listen and being able
to, you know, connect it to

369
00:19:42,300 --> 00:19:45,600
business value.
And so selling the pain is kind

370
00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:52,400
of its I would say measuring
like one of the minor skills of

371
00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:56,500
sales of being good on your feet
on percent also, not a big fan

372
00:19:56,500 --> 00:19:58,200
of that question.
The veracity never been asked.

373
00:19:58,200 --> 00:20:01,300
That question, thankfully I've
got your nose life is long.

374
00:20:01,500 --> 00:20:04,600
Maybe I'll run into that.
Hopefully not though.

375
00:20:04,900 --> 00:20:08,000
All right, so let's move on to a
different part of the interview

376
00:20:08,000 --> 00:20:11,500
process for candidates.
Not not our interview today.

377
00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:14,500
So on our print recall you
mentioned something I'm not

378
00:20:14,500 --> 00:20:18,100
particularly familiar with I've
kind of run into this before in

379
00:20:18,100 --> 00:20:20,700
the past.
However again I'm not exactly

380
00:20:20,700 --> 00:20:23,100
sure what it is or how it
operates or how important it is

381
00:20:23,100 --> 00:20:26,200
in the hiring process.
So you mentioned behavioral

382
00:20:26,200 --> 00:20:29,200
interview questions.
What are those and how do you

383
00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:31,000
structure them?
And what is their goal?

384
00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:33,700
What What color trying to
achieve through those questions.

385
00:20:34,100 --> 00:20:37,100
So, behavioral interview
question is a question where

386
00:20:37,100 --> 00:20:40,200
you're trying to get the
candidate to tell you about

387
00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:43,700
their past Behavior.
People do change over time,

388
00:20:43,700 --> 00:20:47,400
sometimes but generally past
behavior is the best indicator

389
00:20:47,400 --> 00:20:50,200
of future success.
And in a behavioral interview

390
00:20:50,200 --> 00:20:52,800
question, as one of the
follow-ups, if you can ask them,

391
00:20:52,800 --> 00:20:54,800
the lessons that they've
learned, you know, it'll kind of

392
00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:56,900
show you their ability to change
as well.

393
00:20:56,900 --> 00:21:01,000
So a behavioral interview
question for me, is a question

394
00:21:01,000 --> 00:21:05,800
that With tell me about a
specific time, dot dot dot that

395
00:21:05,800 --> 00:21:08,300
dot.
Dot dot is usually a challenging

396
00:21:08,300 --> 00:21:15,400
problem that they faced.
And so the the alternative type

397
00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:19,000
of question is a situational
question which is like, tell me

398
00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:23,600
what you would do if you were in
this situation and behavioral

399
00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:26,400
questions there is research that
shows for knowledge-based jobs

400
00:21:26,400 --> 00:21:31,000
for jobs that have a certain
level of complexity behavioral.

401
00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:33,000
Ooh questions.
Where you ask them to tell you

402
00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:36,500
about past behavior?
Is more predictive than

403
00:21:36,500 --> 00:21:38,600
situational where you ask them
to tell you?

404
00:21:38,800 --> 00:21:43,000
You know, in the situation
you're basically asking you

405
00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:46,300
know, how experienced or smart?
Are you about that this

406
00:21:46,300 --> 00:21:50,500
situation which is less
important than what you actually

407
00:21:50,500 --> 00:21:53,000
did when you were in a similar
situation.

408
00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:57,800
So, a behavioral interview
question that you might get

409
00:21:57,800 --> 00:22:04,200
would be like, tell me about a
specific time. when you're, when

410
00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:09,700
you received feedback that was
difficult to hear, Yep.

411
00:22:09,700 --> 00:22:15,900
And those or good ends.
A couple of other comments about

412
00:22:15,900 --> 00:22:18,600
behavioral questions.
If we have time for it?

413
00:22:18,600 --> 00:22:24,500
Yes motive the each I look at
each behavioral interview

414
00:22:24,500 --> 00:22:27,400
question, as a jumping off point
to a conversation.

415
00:22:27,700 --> 00:22:30,400
So if you were doing an
interview of just behavioral

416
00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:33,200
interview questions, you might
only have three to five

417
00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:37,000
questions in the interview and
like a 30 to 45-minute interview

418
00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:40,300
and because each of those
questions you're going to,

419
00:22:40,500 --> 00:22:43,400
you're going to, you know, try
to understand exactly.

420
00:22:43,500 --> 00:22:46,400
Exactly what the situation was
that the candidate that was in

421
00:22:46,700 --> 00:22:53,100
the, the actions that they took
the results that they got and

422
00:22:53,100 --> 00:22:56,100
any lessons that they learned
out of the situation.

423
00:22:56,100 --> 00:22:58,600
And so you're going to keep
asking follow-up questions, till

424
00:22:58,600 --> 00:23:01,300
you answer all of those things
and you're going to, you know,

425
00:23:01,300 --> 00:23:04,100
kind of be taking notes and
recording the evidence that

426
00:23:04,100 --> 00:23:06,500
they're giving you.
I need two of those so that you

427
00:23:06,500 --> 00:23:08,900
can use it to compare later.
And again you're going to have

428
00:23:08,900 --> 00:23:11,300
ask every candidate.
The same question answer you're

429
00:23:11,300 --> 00:23:14,400
going to get differentiated
responses And so each one of

430
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:16,200
those.
So it's not when I say

431
00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:18,600
structured interview and
behavioral interview questions.

432
00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:21,700
It's not a rope thing question,
answer the question, answer the

433
00:23:21,708 --> 00:23:23,800
question answer.
It's hey we're going to have a

434
00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:27,500
small number of questions, Each
of, which is designed to elicit

435
00:23:27,500 --> 00:23:31,300
a conversation and we're going
to spend go deep and spend you

436
00:23:31,300 --> 00:23:34,100
know, 10 to 15 minutes on each
question.

437
00:23:34,300 --> 00:23:38,200
So that we really get a full
picture of how this candidate

438
00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:40,500
deals with challenges how
they've dealt with challenge

439
00:23:40,700 --> 00:23:43,800
past and what they would change
about how they would Dealt with

440
00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:46,200
that kind of challenge in the
future, right?

441
00:23:46,400 --> 00:23:50,800
And those are great and I'll be
honest with you here, I don't

442
00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:54,300
think that they're particularly
indicative because most of those

443
00:23:54,300 --> 00:23:57,300
answers don't have solid
backing, so they're

444
00:23:57,300 --> 00:23:59,500
unverifiable, so it can, it can
say anything.

445
00:23:59,500 --> 00:24:03,500
But again, it's just how they
can, it approaches out so well.

446
00:24:03,500 --> 00:24:07,300
So I think that when I think
that there's your you bring up

447
00:24:07,300 --> 00:24:10,900
an important point and I want to
re-emphasize something to go

448
00:24:10,900 --> 00:24:14,700
with that point.
If you spend two or three

449
00:24:14,700 --> 00:24:18,600
minutes on the behavioral
question, then the candidate can

450
00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:21,600
make Thing else which I think is
what you're saying.

451
00:24:21,900 --> 00:24:25,500
But if you spend 10 to 15
minutes on the question the

452
00:24:25,500 --> 00:24:28,000
candidate you're going to find
out whether the candidate and

453
00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:30,500
really knows the details of
solving.

454
00:24:30,500 --> 00:24:36,800
The problem of, you know the
deal got stuck at the CFO and so

455
00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,600
like the your they're going to
tell you specifics you know

456
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:42,900
they're going to get into detail
where they're telling you about

457
00:24:42,900 --> 00:24:44,600
a specific customer.
They're telling you specific

458
00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:46,500
stores.
You're going to go beyond where

459
00:24:46,500 --> 00:24:49,500
they can make stuff up.
If you spend 10 to 15 Minutes on

460
00:24:49,500 --> 00:24:51,000
it.
If you spend three or four

461
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:53,400
minutes on it, you're right.
It's not going to be

462
00:24:53,400 --> 00:24:56,300
differentiated, it's not going
to be predictive because you're

463
00:24:56,300 --> 00:24:58,700
not going to go deep enough to
find the real answers.

464
00:24:58,900 --> 00:25:01,900
And so part of it is like making
sure with each of these.

465
00:25:02,300 --> 00:25:07,100
What they really know, you know,
how what chick you know, how did

466
00:25:07,100 --> 00:25:09,500
they really deal with the real
Challenge?

467
00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:13,900
And so it is got like I mean you
are you should have your guard

468
00:25:13,900 --> 00:25:16,700
up like do they really know what
it's like to do this?

469
00:25:16,700 --> 00:25:18,700
I'm going to find out.
I'm going to ask them specific

470
00:25:18,700 --> 00:25:19,800
questions.
Options to get there.

471
00:25:20,100 --> 00:25:23,800
That's number one.
And number two, Is that, you

472
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:26,900
know, you should always in these
stories.

473
00:25:26,900 --> 00:25:29,200
You're going to learn about
different people that they've

474
00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:32,800
worked with, and I think you
should always make the list of

475
00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:35,500
who you want to do reference
calls with and not ask the

476
00:25:35,500 --> 00:25:38,400
candidate for their list of
reference calls they're talking

477
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:40,700
about managers.
They're talking about CEOs that

478
00:25:40,700 --> 00:25:42,600
they had in previous jobs,
right?

479
00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:46,000
Those people down and then
afterwards, you can verify this

480
00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:48,200
stuff.
If you say, hey, I'd love to do

481
00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:52,500
a reference call with your
former CEO or your former ER,

482
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:56,500
can you help set that up for me
and top performers will be happy

483
00:25:56,500 --> 00:25:58,600
to set it up with the people
that you choose.

484
00:25:59,900 --> 00:26:04,200
Low performers will only want to
provide references to people

485
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:07,900
that they've chosen socially
report, that's another

486
00:26:07,900 --> 00:26:10,500
extraordinary part important
part of the interview.

487
00:26:11,500 --> 00:26:14,400
A lot of people including
myself, once again mess that

488
00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:17,600
part out.
So now I would agree but one

489
00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:20,900
caveat on that, you never want
to ask them to do a reference.

490
00:26:20,900 --> 00:26:22,800
Go with the current manager or
their currency.

491
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:25,600
Oh, yeah, absolutely not.
No, no way in hell that that was

492
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:28,900
just blown clear.
Rude, good.

493
00:26:28,900 --> 00:26:31,300
Good point out.
I always just kind of hoping

494
00:26:31,300 --> 00:26:35,400
that people will know that based
on the context of Common Sense.

495
00:26:36,500 --> 00:26:39,600
Alright, so on this note, last
question on the entry port and

496
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:41,300
then we're going to move on to
the very last question of the

497
00:26:41,308 --> 00:26:43,600
whole interview and the last
question on the entry part would

498
00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:47,300
be, what do you think about
behavioral tests?

499
00:26:47,300 --> 00:26:52,200
You know, I've seen a handful of
companies doing like person

500
00:26:52,300 --> 00:26:55,800
Persona tests where you answer a
ton of questions to figure out

501
00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:59,200
if you were introvert and
extrovert or like leader and

502
00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:01,400
things, Like that.
I cannot really put it into

503
00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:04,300
words now because I've done it
over three years ago at this

504
00:27:04,300 --> 00:27:06,700
point.
You think it's reasonable to do

505
00:27:06,700 --> 00:27:08,400
that as like part of the
interview?

506
00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:10,900
Processes are part of the whole
onboarding process or not

507
00:27:10,900 --> 00:27:14,200
really?
There's so Edna.

508
00:27:15,300 --> 00:27:18,600
There's a few of those tests
that I'm certified as an

509
00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:22,700
assessor and the ones that I'm
certified in, you know, which

510
00:27:22,700 --> 00:27:26,100
are some of the well-known ones
things like disc, the disc

511
00:27:26,100 --> 00:27:29,400
profile, and I would say, I'm
not certified in Myers-Briggs.

512
00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:32,600
Say the same for Myers-Briggs, I
think they're better as

513
00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:35,400
management tools that is
pre-hire assessment to us.

514
00:27:36,700 --> 00:27:40,500
That gets, you know, you don't
want to say hey it's you know it

515
00:27:40,500 --> 00:27:42,500
could be tempting to say in
disk.

516
00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:45,400
I only want to hire someone
who's a Heidi and a high for

517
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:48,800
sales and that's not a good way
to build your sales organization

518
00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:51,700
and I don't want to spend too
much time on it you know, given

519
00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:54,000
how much time we have right now
but I just don't think that's a

520
00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:55,400
good way to build your sales
organization.

521
00:27:55,700 --> 00:27:59,400
I do think knowing someone is a
Heidi and a high as a manager.

522
00:27:59,500 --> 00:28:02,200
ER tells me how I know I'm
interrupting Monsieur.

523
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:06,500
Lucas because I don't know what
if Heidi or heii is okay, but

524
00:28:06,500 --> 00:28:11,400
it's also one of these tests
it's called disc in the end.

525
00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:15,000
When you take the, when you take
the test are either, you know,

526
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:18,900
you get scores for your D, which
is your dominant?

527
00:28:18,900 --> 00:28:21,500
Uh-huh.
For your eye, which is, I can't

528
00:28:21,500 --> 00:28:23,800
remember what I stands for, but
it's like your kind of your

529
00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:28,300
optimism, and enthusiasm and
energy, your asses steadiness,

530
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:30,200
and sea is calm.
Clients.

531
00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:35,500
So it would take a great on each
of these risk score on each of

532
00:28:35,500 --> 00:28:38,300
these.
And so, some people think like,

533
00:28:38,300 --> 00:28:41,000
oh, I just want someone who, you
know, as a sales person whose

534
00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:44,200
high-end dominance and high in
pain of energy, and enthusiasm

535
00:28:44,900 --> 00:28:48,400
and and, and knowing that, and
that's not a good way to build

536
00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:51,800
your sales organization, but it
is good to know that when you're

537
00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:56,600
managing someone to like, no,
there there, you know what, like

538
00:28:56,600 --> 00:28:59,400
how they like to be related to
how they like to be motivated.

539
00:28:59,500 --> 00:29:02,600
Added and and it's good to know
that about your manager.

540
00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:07,800
So I think it's a great kind of
relational tool, not great for

541
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:10,200
pre-hire assessments.
Now there are other pre-hire

542
00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:13,700
assessments that are maybe more
specific to sales or more

543
00:29:13,700 --> 00:29:17,300
specific to certain types of
roles that I'm not as you know

544
00:29:17,300 --> 00:29:20,300
that I'm not as familiar with.
And so I'm not trying to write

545
00:29:20,300 --> 00:29:22,300
off the whole thing for pre-hire
assessments.

546
00:29:22,700 --> 00:29:25,900
But generally the ones that I've
spent the most time with, I've

547
00:29:25,900 --> 00:29:28,500
come to the conclusion that
they're better for management

548
00:29:28,500 --> 00:29:31,700
than they are for pre-hire.
Assessments usually you to know.

549
00:29:31,700 --> 00:29:34,400
And yeah it does sound like.
That is exactly case.

550
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:37,100
I'm with you on this one.
Theoretically speaking, I've

551
00:29:37,100 --> 00:29:40,200
never actually done this myself.
So don't know the results, but

552
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:42,000
sounds reasonable enough.
So I am with you.

553
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:45,100
And on this note let's go on
into the very last question of

554
00:29:45,100 --> 00:29:48,600
these interview which is what do
you want the listener to do as

555
00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:52,000
soon as this episode is over,
hopefully to get closer to the

556
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:55,500
successful first hire or
successful for sale regardless

557
00:29:55,700 --> 00:29:57,700
has to be small short actionable
thing.

558
00:29:59,500 --> 00:30:00,900
What do I want the listener to
do?

559
00:30:03,300 --> 00:30:05,800
That's a good question.
I'm not sure how to answer that,

560
00:30:06,500 --> 00:30:12,600
you know, I think that the
challenge of being an early

561
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:16,500
stage startup is sticking with
it and being persistent in the

562
00:30:16,500 --> 00:30:18,800
face of, you know, challenge
after challenge.

563
00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:22,500
So I think what I would say, I'm
not sure if it means just meet

564
00:30:22,500 --> 00:30:25,200
your smart criteria.
But if I'm talking to Founders

565
00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:27,400
in general out there, I think,
the thing I would say, is like,

566
00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:32,500
keep with it, you know, there's
there's going to be so many so

567
00:30:32,500 --> 00:30:35,800
many.
The things along the way.

568
00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:40,800
So many opportunities to bow out
and the, the ones that make it

569
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:43,600
are the ones that keep with it.
But see it through in the face

570
00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:47,200
of challenge after challenge.
Yeah, that's an optimistic to

571
00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:50,200
cure my call to action is going
to be simple.

572
00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:52,100
As always, check out the
description of this episode,

573
00:30:52,100 --> 00:30:54,400
going to take you like one
minute and I'm going to make

574
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:57,900
sure to follow up with Lucas, to
ask, for some resources, may be

575
00:30:57,900 --> 00:31:00,600
relevant books on the
interviewing process, maybe

576
00:31:01,300 --> 00:31:03,200
websites explained by have to
Truck.

577
00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:05,400
Sure.
That Parts made the idea

578
00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:07,400
generation tools.
Anything that's relevant to.

579
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:08,600
What?
We were just talking about

580
00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:12,100
today.
I'm gonna drag out of Lucas and

581
00:31:12,100 --> 00:31:14,300
include in the description of
this episode and of course,

582
00:31:14,300 --> 00:31:15,700
yardstick is also going to be
there.

583
00:31:15,700 --> 00:31:19,200
So if you want things to be done
for you definitely check it out.

584
00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:24,600
And on this note, wrapping up
and have a good day.